spence Wrote:

xClassics Wrote:[spoiler]

jackslammer Wrote:The HoJ is a spec thing and ret pallys can't get imp HoJ and AM, so myself, Rootbear, and then Alyse/rets each grab one of the three stuns and stun when the initial shockwave fades.
HoJ count last night
Humiliation 57
Jackslammer 48
Gouken 21
Crucible 9

Firstly we all need to be using AM more often, we should have four consistent AMs with Talith and they should be utilized two to three times in a kill attempt. Rootbear could respec to the HMLK prot spec and provide five AMs which would be beneficial.
AM count last night
Gouken 10
Jackslammer 8

Divine Sac needs to be used a lot more as well, even without bubbling the 20% less raid wide damage during an infest cast is amazing. DSac breaks when the caster drops low therefore it rarely causes death without a cooldown now, so it can be used a couple times a kill attempt as well.
DSac count last night
Jackslammer 90
Humiliation 45
Crucible 27

TLDR: HoJs are working as intended, Rootbear should respec and utilize AM, and Alyse should use AM and DSac more often. A rotation will be set up for AM in the Frostmourne room.

You might want to include rogues in your stun rotations because sometimes with the valks its a stunning frenzy and the valk goes immune after the first stun, which in turn, causes us to usually lose the valk if the slow comes off for a split second. Making paladins spec into imp HoJ when rogues can do the exact same thing with a 20 second cooldown is pretty redundant, especially since we're using Shockwave as our first stun. At the most only one paladin should have the imp HoJ spec and Rootbear seems to have that down. Too many unassigned and unorganized stuns is our problem, we should have some sort of consistency to who stuns what every single time. I've had times when someone randomly calls out that they are stunning my target just for the fuck of it.

The best possible stun order would look something like this:

Star - Shockwave > Under > ??? > Dead
Circle - Shockwave > Athrun > HoJ > ??? > Dead
Diamond - Shockwave > Rootbear > HoJ > ??? > Dead

With Cheap Shots and Infernals saving valks nearing close to the edge

Doing something that looks roughly like this would free up Aura Masteries for Infests and Frostmourne Room. The solution isn't to have more stuns, its to time the precision of the stuns so that they have the maximum benefit. When this miracle of perfect stuns + good valk stack actually happens valks usually don't even make it past halfway.[/spoiler]

QFT

CAN Wrote:isn't it better to just holy wrath if you are gonna be the second stun anyways

CAN Wrote:may as well just have rogues kidney shot if your gonna waste hoj after dr is already up

jackslammer Wrote:shockwave (4) > kidney (3) > hoj (1.5) > immune (15) = 8.5

xClassics Wrote:All I'm saying is rogue should have absolute priority on 2nd stun on valks. Since we have only 2 rogues one pally will obviously will have to step in and stun the 3rd. Making a rogue waste 5 globals on a stun that lasts 1 second is fucking retarded.

xClassics Wrote:

jackslammer Wrote:shockwave (4) > kidney (3) > hoj (1.5) > immune (15) = 8.5

This is what we should be using. Otherwise I'm wasting dps trying to stun a valk for 1.5 seconds.

jackslammer Wrote:

xClassics Wrote:

jackslammer Wrote:shockwave (4) > kidney (3) > hoj (1.5) > immune (15) = 8.5

This is what we should be using. Otherwise I'm wasting dps trying to stun a valk for 1.5 seconds.

The reason we have HoJ second is because rogues said they couldn't always get 5 points up in 4 seconds.