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+--- Thread: @ROOTBEAR (/showthread.php?tid=72)
Re: @ROOTBEAR - mascaron - 12-04-2008
jackslammer Wrote:Gear isn't an issue, it's lack of players doing research and being motivated if you ask me. I expect every player to browse WWS and forums to maximize their performance and some of our DPS is much lower than it should be.
About our tanks and your argument that their healers didn't heal as much because their tanks took less damage;
Their tanks:
Mtlol: 5260 DTPS
Tranzformr: 4415 DTPS
Warriorpooh: 2294 DTPS
TOTAL DTPS: 11969 DTPS
Our tanks:
Aragon: 5934 DTPS
Abec: 4112 DTPS
Silme: 3191 DTPS
TOTAL DTPS: 13237 DTPS
Also note Rootbear is better geared than Aragon or Silme.
That's an 11% increase in DTPS and their same amount of healers only had to heal for 2/3 as long as us. We outhealed them because our healers are doing their job and doing it well if you ask me. Also did u notice their paladin's top heal being judgment of light on Patchwerk? LOL
After browsing hundreds of WWS recently I came to the conclusion that our tanks DTPS is near or lower than top guild's WWS, our healers HPS and longevity is near or higher than top guild's WWS, but our guild's DPS is well behind top guild's WWS with the exception of a few players.
I know we all work together and don't want to necessarily point my finger at DPS, but we have WWS again and we're analyzing them, all I ask is everyone else do so as well and DPS step it the fuck up!
I refuse to believe every single one of our dps don't research their class and aren't motivated. You realize with that statement you are basically taking the elitist "im easily the best person in the guild and you guys aren't even trying" stance. You are literally saying every single person other than you isn't motivated and doesn't research their class. If you truly believe what you said, then gtfo. Like I said, that guild and other tops guilds have raided a week longer than we have. If I remember correctly we didn't even kill Malygos until 2 weeks in. While it's not a big deal since content doesn't require it, and that week / 2 weeks will fade as time goes on, it still explains why they are farther along in terms of gear.
You realize that your hps will increase if the tanks are taking more dmg correct? The fact that you "outhealed" the healers in another group doesnt reflect much. Like I said, the pallies in that guild were spamming FoL for the most part.. yet the tanks didn't die. If that's all it takes to keep up the tanks, then why would they need to do more? The fact that you had to do more healing is a direct reflection on tank gear.
Edit: took out my quote to reduce a little length
Re: @ROOTBEAR - jackslammer - 12-05-2008
mascaron Wrote:I refuse to believe every single one of our dps don't research their class and aren't motivated. You realize with that statement you are basically taking the elitist "im easily the best person in the guild and you guys aren't even trying" stance. You are literally saying every single person other than you isn't motivated and doesn't research their class. If you truly believe what you said, then gtfo.I refuse to believe every one of our raiders research their class and I simply stated I expect them to. I really don't understand how "Gear isn't an issue, it's lack of players doing research and being motivated if you ask me" is turned into "im easily the best person in the guild and you guys aren't even trying" and I don't understand what's with the "gtfo" comment. Do you feel threatened because somebody is calling people on their shit? Or do you really think I'm just stroking my epeen when I analyze WWS? Either way I'd like you to show me what I could do to improve my healing, because I know their is plenty of room for it.
mascaron Wrote:Like I said, that guild and other tops guilds have raided a week longer than we have. If I remember correctly we didn't even kill Malygos until 2 weeks in. While it's not a big deal since content doesn't require it, and that week / 2 weeks will fade as time goes on, it still explains why they are farther along in terms of gear.Again, since you misunderstood my first statement, gear isn't the issue it is player's doing their research and being motivated that is the reason why some players (NOT EVERY PLAYER) are performing worse than equally geared players of their class when I analyze WWS.
mascaron Wrote:You realize that your hps will increase if the tanks are taking more dmg correct? The fact that you "outhealed" the healers in another group doesnt reflect much. Like I said, the pallies in that guild were spamming FoL for the most part.. yet the tanks didn't die. If that's all it takes to keep up the tanks, then why would they need to do more? The fact that you had to do more healing is a direct reflection on tank gear.Apparently you skipped that part of my previous post or misunderstood it as well, because their tanks only took 11% less damage per second than ours, and their paladins were using judgment of light as their top heal. If you really want to bitch about my healing or want a better comparison look at other guild's WWS for Patchwerk.
Now I'm looking at DPS WWS and it's clear that some of our DPS is under performing, and I check armory, and it's not a gear difference. So I'm glad you have such faith in our DPS and believe they are all researching their class but I'm frustrated that our tank's DTPS is rivaling top guilds and our healers HPS is rivaling top guilds, but then when it comes to DPS we fall short with the exception of a handful of players.
Oh ya and a simple key so I don't have to repeat the same argument after you misunderstand it again;
some, handful, a few, etc. =/= all
exception =/= everything or all
equally geared =/= has two week advantage
DTPS = damage taken per second
HPS = healing per second
"outheal" = relatively higher raw and effective healing
research = addons, forums, spec, playstyle, rotation, consumables, etc.
motivation = getting to raid on time ready to go with newest addons, best available consumables, etc.
WWS = WoW Web Stats
doing their job =/= they think they're the best ever
Re: @ROOTBEAR - Archlight - 12-05-2008
^ :o
Re: @ROOTBEAR - Entrapment - 12-05-2008
Keep in mind most of those raids had the various hybrid buffs. Until recently we didn't have a boomkin, and 13% damage is big. For example, our first Patchwerk, I did the same dps as our most recent one. The difference is the fact that I got a lot more gear, but didn't have windfury/feral buff.
Re: @ROOTBEAR - Masex - 12-05-2008
Masex: Is it a bug with Ferocious Inspiration? WTB secret.
Laan: there secret is a bug where your tank gets patchwerk's enrage.
Laan: there ya go
ionno. i don't really know the dude very well, and i didn't want to nag like a bitch.
Re: @ROOTBEAR - Entrapment - 12-05-2008
I don't see how that's possible. That bear tank began doing insane damage at 18:58'40.654 whereas Patchwerk frenzies at 18:59'15.455, a solid 35 seconds afterwards.
Re: @ROOTBEAR - CAN - 12-05-2008
best thing to always remember about dps is if it crits it crits..
aka RNG
Re: @ROOTBEAR - jackslammer - 12-05-2008
Entrapment Wrote:Keep in mind most of those raids had the various hybrid buffs. Until recently we didn't have a boomkin, and 13% damage is big. For example, our first Patchwerk, I did the same dps as our most recent one. The difference is the fact that I got a lot more gear, but didn't have windfury/feral buff.If our DPS is lower than what is expected because of raid composition that is something easily fixable, for example I plan on using five healers for Naxxramas next week since it's evident that we can get away with less than the standard seven healers and that will make room for more DPS to make up for.
Re: @ROOTBEAR - abecx - 12-05-2008
I love how quick people point fingers everywhere but themselves
Moonkin wont knock someones dps up from 2k to just under 4k. Looking for ways to exploit the game to get a druid doing 11k dps is stupid, go try that elsewhere. Dead dps = no dps and that has and still is a very common problem, from standing where you're not supposed to be, to pulling threat, to just being an idiot.
Re: @ROOTBEAR - amped - 12-05-2008
abecx Wrote:I love how quick people point fingers everywhere but themselves
Moonkin wont knock someones dps up from 2k to just under 4k. Looking for ways to exploit the game to get a druid doing 11k dps is stupid, go try that elsewhere. Dead dps = no dps and that has and still is a very common problem, from standing where you're not supposed to be, to pulling threat, to just being an idiot.
guys lets stack group 1 i want to hit 5000 threat per second, come on guys.....