DKP

[mininolan]

What's wrong with using alts? Especially since the alts we generally use are piloted by very capable players.

25 man is not more challenging. In fact, Blizzard has said that it will be the least challenging of the two in terms of boss difficulty. Blizzard understands the fact that what makes 25 mans harder is not the challenge of the encounter, it’s the 15 good players carrying the 10 average/bads. This makes them harder but not more challenging. Overcoming the stupidity of the warm bodies you bring in to fill out a raid is not a challenge and, for me at least, it is not fun. It’s a chore and an annoyance. Raid 10 man with nine players if that's what you're looking for. That will be more consistantly challenging than essentially artificially inflating the difficulty of an encounter with the RNG that someone dumb will do something dumb.

You guys have spent the last three pages of this thread talking about how we should compensate people on the WL because they’re not raiding for the good of the guild. Here’s a way that everyone who wants to raid gets to raid. Between mains and alts, we have enough GOOD players to make at least two really solid 10 mans. Possibly three. And enough other people that want to raid that we could make a couple more after that.

Multiple ten mans would offer more flexibility too. Groups could be made that just raid Sat/Sun at a relaxed pace or stick to a more hardcore daily raid schedule or even a hardcore raid that gets all their raiding done for the week in one longer stretch ala Friday PUG style.

Don’t get me wrong. I think this change that Blizzard has made is ridiculous. The bonus for putting up with bads used to be better loot, but now they’ve stupidly taken that away. Obstinately this was done to cater to the casuals, the theory being that it will be easier for casual players to find a raid. But what they’ve really done is completely removed any incentive for a good player to take a causal player into an instance. It’s stupid, but that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t embrace it or that we should make things harder on ourselves for no good reason.

Really the only valid argument I can think of for 25 man raiding is that we can always switch to 10 if it doesn’t work out. But by that time, you’ve wasted a bunch of time and set up an organizational structure that just has to be taken down and rebuilt. And for what?

The effect on the guild seems valid until you think about it. How many people in the guild do you really like and enjoy playing with? And how many are friends of friends that you don’t know and don’t give a lick about? For me it’s probably less than two dozen of the one and more than two hundred of the other.

SOMEONE SAY THEY NEED A PILOT?????????????